PART B

Sometimes it's not only two things, but it can be many objects at the same time. If we are confused, we must note, "confusion, confusion". But then if you don't know what to note, you can stop mental noting, drop mental noting and just observe. Just don't do anything but just observe and naturally, something will become more predominant. Then you begin mental noting again.

So, is that the end?

T "Observing is one thing and noting is another thing, different?"

But we use the noting as a technique for observing.

T "Well in case predominant factors come into his mind, so constant, so many predominant factors, come into his mind at one time, how should we note?"

Y "One thing in a second and next thing in a second. So, we cannot note, label the word."

Too quick? ?

Y "Too quick to label."

So again, stop mental noting and just observe.

"Not label?"

No need to label, no need to note, but you just see. Ah! this pain. Ah, this feeling. Ah, this hearing. Ah, thinking, Ah, this pain, you know what is happening. Sometimes it's too fast, then don't note, just observe.

Observing is the main point of the meditation. Mental noting is just to help us to stay more precisely with these objects. So mental noting is an aid or a tool or a technique for observing.

Also, if we are busy using mental noting, then it stops us from thinking and analyzing and worrying about the object that we are observing. If you are thinking or analyzing or worrying then you should note, "thinking, thinking, thinking", "analyzing, analyzing", "worrying, worrying ....."

OK, I think we will have just another five minute sit and then we'll do something else.

<< five minutes meditation >>

So it's now five minutes, you can relax, open your eyes. So, was that different for you this time?

T "At this time a little bit different from previous one.

Previous one he was wondering what is the dominating factor of his meditation. But this time not so much.

Maybe because he followed your instruction or teaching."

So what was the main object that he noted?

"Mostly sound and noises."

No, we don't note the sound or the noise. We note, "hearing". Hearing happens internally, sound is external. Many sounds but only one hearing. If you think, or if you think about that sound, 'Oh, that's a bird, that's a car', then that is thinking, imagining. Then you note, "thinking, thinking", "imagining, imagining".

Y "I see."

That is OK, it's alright. Yes, everything that we experience is OK, natural.

If you are thinking, it's OK but if you know your thinking, then it's better. If you are hearing and you know you are hearing, then that is good. If there is pain, it's OK to have pain. We all have pain, we all have hearing, we all have thinking. But if you know it's happening then that is wisdom, that is knowing what is happening in your mind, in your body. [Living in the present moment]

And so, how about you? Different?

T "Well like the first case, he was seeing rising, falling and after that, without knowing, something soft, blue color and sometimes looking dry, very big like a wrapping cloth for the Japanese, Japanese wrapping cloth, we call it "Furo Shiki" wrapping cloth or big umbrella, blue colors, one flying just around him and it's falling down, fell down to his face. And then he thought this must be delusion or this is a .... Oh no! And he found, oh, I'm not dreaming. 'And then I didn't know what it was and what happened to myself. This is what he explained."

So, when we see something in the mind we just note, "seeing, seeing". Often we get interested in something. We see it is unusual or interesting or fascinating, so then the mind starts to follow it and play with it and enjoy it, then we get lost in that feeling or in that vision. So in order to not get lost in that vision we must note, "seeing, seeing, seeing".

T "In order to get rid of this?"

Not to get rid of it, but so as we don't get further involved in it. [To see it, as it is, in its impermanent nature.)

T "In order not to get involved further, we keep saying, "feeling, feeling"?"

Yes, or "seeing, seeing", [noting it as we experience it). Often in the consciousness, in seeing consciousness or seeing mind, we see a blue object that often becomes large and sometimes small and large and small, changing.

T "Is that alright?"

Going in and out or small or disappearing and then becoming big. If we get involved in it and enjoy it and say, "Oh! Wao! Look at this. Oh! This is interesting", then this is not meditation. We just note, "seeing, seeing, interested, interested".

T "Because he was not so surprised at seeing something blue he did note, "feeling, feeling", "seeing, seeing". He was not disturbed by the noise from the outside when he was saying, "feeling ..." and "seeing ..." or something blue coming to his mind."

At that time, he didn't feel anything? And did he feel anything else in his body?

T "He was quite comfortable. He was not scared or anything."

This is quite a normal experience. Anything that is unusual in meditation, we shouldn't worry about it and also we shouldn't get involved in it or enjoy it. If that happens then we lose the meditation. We should note, "enjoying, enjoying" or "worrying, worrying". In that way, we always stay calm and in the centre of everything that happens around us.

T "At the last stage of the five minutes of the meditation he was wondering, 'Why am I seeing something funny, something blue?' So then he was very worried, he was wondering why he saw something blue coming into his mind."

So that's "worrying, worrying" or "analyzing, analyzing" or "thinking, thinking" or "wondering, wondering".

OK so we'll move on. Yes, just briefly what objects did you experience or what objects did you note?

H "I know the expansion ....."

We say rising and falling.

H "And heavy, thinking and vibration in my palms." Did you have some new experience?

H So different from before, I could follow your instructions. I felt enjoy. Maybe I enjoy but I didn't note enjoy ...."

Enjoy .... Yes, often that also happens. You feel happy about your ability to understand the meditation, so then you must note, "happy, happy" or "enjoying, enjoying".

Even if you are peaceful and calm, you must note, "peaceful, peaceful .....", "calm, calm ....". Sometimes we feel there is nothing to note, at that time we can note, "nothing, nothing ....".

So whatever it is, you just note it and keep noting it and that means the meditation keeps going. Often when we become peaceful we start to enjoy peacefulness then we just do nothing. We just enjoy the peacefulness but we don't know that we are enjoying the peace, you see so we are not meditating. We have lost the meditation, we have lost our mindfulness because we are enjoying the peace, then we don't know that there is peace. So we must note, "peace, peace, peace", "calm, calm, calm", "enjoying, enjoying", "hearing, hearing", "thinking", "pain", "feeling", "touching" ......

Also, another object that we can note, is the sitting posture, we can note it as, "sitting, sitting". That means that the mind is just aware that the body is sitting. Also, we may note the touching points under our buttocks or under our feet or at our hands, we can note, "sitting", "touching, touching". Sometimes when the rising and falling is not predominant or not obvious or not clear, then we can note, "sitting, touching, touching", [sitting posture and] two touching points, "sitting, touching, touching", "sitting, touching, touching", continuously.

Y "Consciously?"

Yes, must be consciously but I said, continuously.

Y "It's not natural, isn't it?"

Not as natural as I have been explaining but sometimes, people don't know what to note or they can't feel anything obvious, so then we can note, "sitting, touching, touching". It's not natural observation but [they are] objects of sitting meditation that we can observe.

Sometimes the sitting posture becomes very comfortable and we don't have any strong feeling, rising, falling is not strong, no pain, but sitting comfortably, so then sometimes we can use this technique of observing the sitting posture and two touching points.

OK. So what did you note in your last sitting?

T "Well, like the previous case, rising and falling and then he felt the touching point at the same level and then he was wondering which one of those two, rising and falling, or the touching point should he concentrate on. So then he started to be a little bit confused to concentrate his attention. So then, according to your teaching you said everything should be as it is, as they are, but it's too free to do that. So then instead of confusing with two factors in his case, he was saying that we had better concentrate to one thing and then that is the best way to make a right choice."

Well, then he should have noted, "confusing, confusing ..." [until it disappeared] and then after he noted that, his mind would be clear about what to note.

If he is thinking about the meditation practice or analyzing the meditation practice, then he should note, "thinking , thinking ...." or "analyzing, analyzing ...".

If he really wants to, he can just observe the rising and falling of the abdomen. if you concentrate only on the rise and fall of the abdomen, you will gain wisdom about the rise and fall of the abdomen. if we observe seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling and thinking, then we will gain wisdom about seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, smelling and thinking. So my point is, if you observe one object most of the time then you'll have wisdom about that one object. If you note many objects, all of the time you will have wisdom about many objects.

T "Can I ask one question? What is the definition of the wisdom?"

What is the definition of the wisdom?

"Wisdom is different from knowledge?"

Yes, knowledge we can get from a book or from a teacher or from an external source. Wisdom is something that we experience and feel and learn through our own senses, through our own understanding. Wisdom is understanding.

T "So then, shall we proceed to the next session, Q & A?"

I was going to also show some standing meditation and walking meditation but it's up to you.

T "We have a session in May, so then in the May session we can do walking etc. So then today, time is so limited, we would like to proceed to the Q & A session."

Yes, sure.

H "I have been studying psychotherapy. Now I am a yoga instructor and a psycho-counsellor. I am interested in integration vipassana meditation and psychotherapy because vipassana meditation helps me a lot to accept myself.

So I am thinking, I don't have a concrete idea now but maybe I will create a method. So do you think it is possible and if you do, could you give me some advice?"

The practice of vipassana meditation is psychoanalysis. It's self psychoanalysis and it's teaching people to understand themselves.

A professor of psychology can lecture and lecture and lecture and tell you all about the mind, and the mind according to great scientists, according to himself, according to his teachers, according to everybody else. But that still doesn't give you a clear understanding about your mind. The professor is not teaching you how to understand your mind, [he's only telling you about it].

We can only understand our mind and other people's minds, through our mind. First we have to understand, 'What is my mind? How does my mind work?' Then you can understand what these professors are really teaching you. Do you understand?

So vipassana meditation is a technique for me, us, to understand our own minds. When we understand our own mind, then we can understand when someone talks to us about the mind or about mental states or mental phenomena or mental conditions.

T "Like the case of the wisdom and knowledge, right?"

Right. So it's about people learning to understand their own mind and it's for everyone, not just for patients or not just for housewives or businessmen, Yoga people or Buddhists but it is for everyone to learn how to understand themselves.

We can only understand this world through our own mind. So first we have to understand what is this mind, 'How do I understand? How do I react to that which I experience? When I feel pain, how do I react? When I am hot or cold, how do I react? How do I think?' When we understand this, then we can understand more clearly how everybody else also lives, thinks and experiences life.

H "Do you think it is nonsense to integrate vipassana meditation and psychotherapy?"

No, I think that they are same thing. I think vipassana meditation is psychotherapy. It's just that we don't call it psychotherapy. We call it vipassana meditation but it's self-analysis. It's teaching people to analyze themselves, [through close introspection].

So it's a different approach. One thing is that it can't be learned over night, in a short time. It takes a long time to learn how to practice very well and how to observe correctly without going off on different [tangents] and extremes, different ways of observing.

They have to be neutral and natural points of observation. But it's difficult because we are always thinking. So, Vipassana Meditation can naturally be used in psychotherapy.

Y 'Thank you."

No problem.

T "How do we make the practice in daily life?"

The best way is, at first we have to understand the practice and we have to do some intensive meditation practice, that is, at least for a consecutive ten day period. But preferably for one month, two months or three months of consecutive and continuous meditation. Then we can understand the practice very well.

When we understand the practice very well, then we can be more accurately and more precisely aware of our mental and emotional states.

When we are aware of our mental states and emotional feelings, then in the daily practice it doesn't matter where you go or what you do, your awareness is on your emotional and mental states. So I'll stop there, I have something to continue.

In the beginning, we observe the body and we observe feelings and sensations in the body and also we observe movement and actions, this trains us in our observation of our body.

When we become skillful later on, we are able to more closely observe the [more subtle] mental and emotional states. Then in our daily life we can go anywhere and do anything but still be aware of our mental and emotional states, these are the most important, [they are what drive our existence].

Y 'Two months or three months continuous retreat, we need?"

At least one month, intensive, non-stop, day and night.

Y "Sleep only four hours?"

Two or three, four hours, five, maybe six but better three or four.

T "Unless he finishes the intensive practice, is it impossible for him to achieve the target of the meditation?"

No, not impossible, but it's a lot more difficult! A ten day meditation retreat is just the beginning of really grasping the practice of meditation. One month, we can come to a good understanding. Three months, brings a better understanding, a more full understanding of really what it is that we are doing [both in the practice and in life in general]. My first retreat in Myanmar was seven months long.

T "According to his understanding the ten days or one month or three months of intensive meditation is a very hard job for the ordinary people who are living the normal ordinary lives, so then he wants to know whether it is also impossible for the ordinary people to get the target or goal of your meditation."

This is a hypothetical question, a theoretical question.

Actually, if you consider, in Osaka City there are how many million people? How many million people in Osaka? The population?...How many people in this room? We can count on one hand.

For the people outside, it's not for us really to be concerned whether those people can understand, it's important that if you practice ten days or one month or three months then you will understand, people in the street are not interested in meditation. [But they haven't heard about it, you have. The choice is yours.]

Only special people who really want to know, What is my mind? What is my body? What is this life? What is love? What is hatred? What is anger? Anger? Frustration? Confusion? People who really want to know these things, they will practice the meditation.

The man in the street can understand this meditation. Children can practice this meditation, old people can practice but not very many people want to really understand their mind and body. They want to go shopping! They want to go to the movies. They want to go on holidays. They want to go to work. They want to go to sleep.

T "Well, we sitting here in this room this afternoon, we are not special people. We have our own business. And how do you explain the way to go, where we should go as ordinary people who are living ordinary lives?

I say that you, we, are special because it is indeed rare to hear about how to observe your body and mind in this way which can lead to peace and happiness through right understanding.

T "In a sense we are one of the people on the street, so then what he meant, I believe is that it is almost impossible for us to continue the practice for such a long time as seven months or something like that. This is my understanding about his question."

Well, I was a person on the street. I was nobody, I still am nobody. I am still just a person on the street. I think what he wants to know is how he can use daily practice.

We can. Anybody can practice some sitting or walking meditation in the morning, some sitting or walking in the night. And we can be aware of our mental [and emotional] states and our activities during the day. When anger arises, we can note, "anger, anger, anger's and that anger passes away. But what I am saying is, before you can become skillful in the observation of mental states and physical processes you must understand the practice very well. In order to understand the practice very well, then you should try to do an intensive period of meditation. [In order to get it right, then you can do it anywhere, anytime.]

T "From your teaching today, I started to wonder that your meditation is a sort of, say, psychology which means a sort of science. So then my question is, your meditation is a science or religion?"

We can say it is either, we can say it is both or we can say it is neither. This question is always asked, not only about meditation but about Buddhism. Is Buddhism a religion or is it a science? Or is it a philosophy? We often say, it's a way of life.

T "It's, means Buddhism?"

It's, Buddhism, is a way of life. It's a way in which you can live and practice in your daily life. It's mindfulness, awareness, that's all.

I am not a scientist, I am not an intellectual, I didn't finish senior high school. All I have done and all I do now is experience life, but now I am observing more closely my own experiences.

As a child and a young man, I listened to what other people told me. I tried to follow religion, my parents, my brothers and sisters, my teachers, the law, as in the government or police and eventually, I started to just believe in what I thought was right and what I believed in.

That's when I ended up practicing meditation and when I found out that there is a meditation, that teaches you what I was already trying to do, then I thought, I must learn this meditation.

So after about four years of practice, still my understanding is not perfect, it's somewhat clearer but there is a long way for me to continue in my practice.

But in the world today there are very few people who can actually teach this meditation in plain and simple terms. So I didn't come here because I wanted to teach meditation. I came here because I was invited by Mr. Suzuki and I was also sent by my teacher. I am not a tourist, and if they didn't invite me or send me, then I would still be practicing meditation in Myanmar.

Also now in Malaysia, I have taught meditation in about five cities and they all have asked me to stay in the city and continue to teach meditation.

It's not because of my desire but simply because there are few people in the world who can teach this. And many modern people, particularly in big cities are realizing that the world seems to be going out of control. And there are some people who are seeking to understand this world, through their own mind. Vipassana meditation teaches this. So I end up being a Vipassana meditation teacher but really I am just someone who wants to understand myself. So, can I help you?

Y "Yes, very much."

What do you want to know? Any more questions? We still have time.

Y "Do you believe that there is life after death?"

Death is the end of this life. Shall I continue?

That is the end of this life. Because of this life, because of our greed and our desire to live and to continue our life, then that desire is the cause for another existence. So, because of that strong desire and that attachment to life, then when this body dies there is another beginning of another existence.

Y "If our greed or desire is too strong or strong, there is life after death. Do you think? What kind of life is it?"

We don't know, no-one can know.

Y "Not your belief?"

If this is a good life, then there will be another good life. If this is a bad life, then there will be a bad life. This is Kamma, cause and effect.

T "We understood that you believe the cycle of life."

Yes, the cycle of life is a general term.

"Well, he said that man is mortal."

Not "mind is mortal"?

T "No, man. Human being is mortal, we have to die. So then what should we do to our ancestors to make as a descendant from?"

Yes, in Theravadan Buddhism we don't worship our ancestors. They are not in existence now and they don't have anything directly to do with our present moment experiences. We can serve our parents if they are alive now. But our ancestors who are dead, What can we do with them?

T 'This question is closely related to his personal background. His father has just passed away last year. He believes that there is a teaching of the life of the cycle."

Cycle of life?

T "So it's the cycle of the life? He is still keeping a small piece of the bone of his father in a special place in his home. And his wife is suggesting to him that we have to do something for our parents.

So then according to your teaching, you said that we cannot do anything for the process or personal way according to your understanding, according to your teaching. So then if this is the final conclusion or final point of your teaching as well as a Buddhist, how should he make his father or the spirit of his father happier in the heaven or something like that? This is the question he want to ask."

Well, I don't know. I don't know how you can make a spirit happy. His father's life and life cycle is not his life or his life cycle.

T "His means him."

His, Yes. So he can make his own life good and his own next life good but how can we make another person's life good or their lives?

T "Even his father?"

His father, Yes. Because his father's existence is not his existence. They are two different existence's, two different minds, two different bodies. Two different, if you like, life cycles. So I don't know how you can make someone or something happy after it is dead.

During this existence we can do good things to promote our own good existence in the future. The only way we can help, is to teach them how to make their lives good now. So their lives in the future will be good. Otherwise, you are talking about burning incense or praying or singing, dancing, chanting or reciting ancient scriptures or something, I don't know if that works.

Y "If I am going to die and I am lying down. What I should do is Vipassana Meditation? My heart is beating too strong and there are those things. What should I do in my death time?"

Yes, this is what our teacher said; if you are about to die its more important to be aware of what you are feeling physically and mentally, and be aware of it, either by noting it or just knowing how you are feeling'. This is the most important thing at the point of death, is to know what you are really experiencing. To be mindful. Or you can reflect on the good things that you did in this life. Or you can try to chant something like "Buddha, Buddha, Buddha" or something like that if you want to. I don't know, I never died. If I died before, I don't remember it.

T "Can I ask one question? Well, I understand that in Australia, you are Australian, at my best knowledge, everything including the constitution or government systems and everything is based on Christianity. So then when you decided to move from Australia to Burma, to practice meditation, how did you make your decision, final decision, psychological decision to change from your psychological background or spiritual background or physical background to a completely new one?"

It was a general transition and it took some time of course. As I said, when I first heard about Vipassana meditation, I realized that, that was how I was already thinking anyway. I wasn't a Christian, I was a free thinker and I believed in myself. So vipassana meditation fitted my way of life at that time.

Shall I continue? So then after I learned vipassana meditation or I found out about it, then I realized vipassana meditation is Buddhism. And Buddhism was very strong in Myanmar and the people in Myanmar are wonderful people. I had been there as a tourist. So I decided then, that would be where I would go. It all happened by itself, it wasn't so much a decision it unfolded.

H "Negativity arose and it passed away. I know what happened in my experience but I wonder what happened in my body and mind. Could you explain logic?"

Logically?

H "Logically, yes or scientific view point."

So what you mean is, when you are meditating and a negative feeling arises and you note, "negative, negative" and you see it, it passes away. You don't understand the process, is that right?

H "I know this process. I know what happened, my experience. But I don't know what happen logically. What happened in my mind, logically?

OK. As I said before, when any mental state arises, when anything arises in the mind, for example, you are thinking about your family, so you can note, "thinking, thinking, thinking".

What happens at that time is, you know that there is thinking but when the noting finishes and the thought arises again, you see the thought, so you note, "thinking, thinking". 'Thinking finishes because the noting begins. The noting finishes, the thought arises. We note it, it passes away. Slowly, more noting, less thinking.

The noting and knowing, displaces thinking. So at first, thinking is continuous but then you note, "thinking, thinking, thinking". So it's breaking up the thought into pieces, not continuous any more. Thinking, [note] gap, thinking, [note] gap. So you note more, "thinking, thinking, thinking". Thinking disappears, noting is more. Thinking becomes less, noting or knowing becomes more. At that time your knowing or wisdom displaces the delusion. Can you follow?

Y "The same thing can be said about the emotion?"

Same principle, yes. I gave you the example, you were thinking about your family. So you just note, "thinking, thinking, thinking" but about that thought, you feel angry, angry with your brother or mother or husband, child. So you are angry, "angry, angry, angry, angry", there is a thought that makes you angry.

So there is the thinking but there is anger too. We can note, "thinking" but it's better to note, "angry, angry, angry". The same thing happens, it breaks the anger up, you are noting, "angry" but you don't see anger. At first, you see anger, "angry, angry, angry", then you see noting, ah, noting! Noting what? No anger! just noting, so, gone.

Then, "analyzing, analyzing, analyzing". You start thinking about your experience. 'Why did my anger disappear?' [You keep on noting whatever arises next.] It's the same principle with all mental states.

T "Well, let me ask the last question. Very simple question. The final goal or the object, final, say, target of your meditation is the calmness in our mind, psychological or spiritual or calmness in our mind? Let me ask another way. What is the final object of your meditation? After we become so happy after ten months of practice, if you don't mind, please give me some clear picture of your answer. What is the reward of such a hard time of practice?"

You see there are results and benefits of the practice as we experience but then there is a final goal also.

T "Sorry, I couldn't follow you, Sorry."

There are benefits and results and things that we experience along the way but then, there is a final goal. So what do you want to know about, things that we can experience in the course of our practice or do you want to know what is the final goal?

The final goal is purification of mind. That is, no more greed, no more hatred and no more delusion but just knowing, knowing everything that is happening. It's not a common phenomena. We don't find people with purification, complete purification of mind.

You have heard of Nirvana or we say Nibbana? So you don't find people with Nibbana just walking in the street. Very, very few people ever really achieved that complete purification but it can happen and that is the teaching of the Buddha. It's to achieve the complete purification of mind. At that time it is also called the cessation of suffering.

T "Cessation?"

Finish, the end of suffering, also no more rebirth. So it also means the end of the cycle of life. No more rebirth, because you have no more greed or no more desire to be a human being again.

Because you see, human beings are full of greed, hatred and delusion. Why do we want to be another one again? So because we don't understand that, we have all of this greed, hatred and delusion, then we want to be human beings, we want to live, we want to have everything.

So this perpetuates our cycle of existences. But once you understand, 'Ah, this life is full of greed, hatred, delusion, even in myself, I have this desire, this aversion, this confusion, it's in me! Then why do I want to continue this for myself?' So it's a deep understanding of yourself. You can understand intellectually and shallow but there is a far deeper understanding.

[May you all fully understand the teaching of The Buddha and attain to Nibbana, the cessation of suffering.]

Enquiries about this book or related topics

may be forwarded to:

CHANMYAY YEIKTHA MEDITATION

CENTRES

55 A Kaba Aye Pagoda rd

Yangon 11061 MYANMAR

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